DDM HID install GENII Busa

[Kerry_129]

I don't follow an HID (or any current draw less than the starter) would cause a battery issue, but there may be something I'm not aware of.

But as for the operating wattage/current, that's not the whole picture. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inrush_current
Older systems had a lot more than the newer 'slow start' ballasts, but the startup current draw is still several times the warmed-up operating current. Notice the amperages listed on this DDM tuning unit: http://www.ddmtuning.com/content/tec...llastspecs.pdf

3.2A operating vs. 15A max

[Trip]

Originally Posted by Kerry_129

I don't follow an HID (or any current draw less than the starter) would cause a battery issue, but there may be something I'm not aware of.

It's the amps you are hammering on the battery, while not enough to finish your battery quickly, it decreases the life of your battery drastically. Say you are getting 3-5 years out of a battery, you may see 1-2 years out of it with the HIDs. An incandescent bulb does have an in rush current, but it's not nearly as much as the chinese HID ballasts, you can find ballasts that are much lower current draw at start up, but the thin ones tend to be high current draw ones. Not only are you putting this extra current on the battery before start up, but during startup so you are hammering the battery twice with this extra current. Where as you really only do it once with a Incandescent because the temp of the bulb doesn't really change all that much during start so the inrush is not an issue on the incandescent, where as the ballast has to recharge to fire again.

As for the Imax of those HID ballasts being 15A, I may test mine and see what it actually is. I got an old battery and an ammeter. My ballasts are sitting in the garage not being used.

[Amber Lamps]

Originally Posted by Trip

It's the amps you are hammering on the battery, while not enough to finish your battery quickly, it decreases the life of your battery drastically. Say you are getting 3-5 years out of a battery, you may see 1-2 years out of it with the HIDs. An incandescent bulb does have an in rush current, but it's not nearly as much as the chinese HID ballasts, you can find ballasts that are much lower current draw at start up, but the thin ones tend to be high current draw ones. Not only are you putting this extra current on the battery before start up, but during startup so you are hammering the battery twice with this extra current. Where as you really only do it once with a Incandescent because the temp of the bulb doesn't really change all that much during start so the inrush is not an issue on the incandescent, where as the ballast has to recharge to fire again.

As for the Imax of those HID ballasts being 15A, I may test mine and see what it actually is. I got an old battery and an ammeter. My ballasts are sitting in the garage not being used.

Oh yea? Well my ballasts were made in Germany for your information AND I'd like you to do an amps test on a halogen bulb. I found one goofy site that says they pull 17A and another that claims 6-8, either way, I'm not sure how pulling a few more amps for a minute or less and then going down to about 3 amps for the rest of the time is WORSE than pulling 6-17 amps ALL OF THE TIME!!! Besides, I've had HIDs on my bike since it was almost new and I don't have any problems in 30,000+ miles on the stock battery. Heck, before HIDs I had Osram Xtra bulbs which pull a truckload of amps. I think it's 8-10 but I'll have to check. Regardless, you have to concede my original premise that HIDs pull less power no matter how you slice it! Shit man I don't claim to be an engineer but how does a 55W/9A draw compare to a 35W/15A draw anyway? I'd also imagine that you also believe that 100W bulbs are battery killers as well since they must dram a butt load of amps, right?

Oh and everyone with HIDs turn on your bike and wait for the bulb to heat up. Time it. Now turn the key off and right back on and see if it takes that long the second time....

[Amber Lamps]

Hey and don't be honking that horn 5-10 amps!!!

I'm tired of fucking with you Trip, maybe I'll install a switch to turn the headlights off, so I can wait to turn them on once the bike is running.

[Trip]

Originally Posted by TIGGER

Oh yea? Well my ballasts were made in Germany for your information AND I'd like you to do an amps test on a halogen bulb. I found one goofy site that says they pull 17A and another that claims 6-8, either way, I'm not sure how pulling a few more amps for a minute or less and then going down to about 3 amps for the rest of the time is WORSE than pulling 6-17 amps ALL OF THE TIME!!! Besides, I've had HIDs on my bike since it was almost new and I don't have any problems in 30,000+ miles on the stock battery. Heck, before HIDs I had Osram Xtra bulbs which pull a truckload of amps. I think it's 8-10 but I'll have to check. Regardless, you have to concede my original premise that HIDs pull less power no matter how you slice it! Shit man I don't claim to be an engineer but how does a 55W/9A draw compare to a 35W/15A draw anyway? I'd also imagine that you also believe that 100W bulbs are battery killers as well since they must dram a butt load of amps, right?

Oh and everyone with HIDs turn on your bike and wait for the bulb to heat up. Time it. Now turn the key off and right back on and see if it takes that long the second time....

If you install a non OEM bulb that uses a substantial amount of amperage on start up, than you should put in a switch or timer delay. This is one of the reason why dirt bikes and dual sport bikes have these switches installed on their extra lights.

55W bulbs don't pull 9A or they aren't 55W. If it is labeled a 55W, it's going to be close to the standard I = V/R ohm's law. So it's probably going to be in the neighborhood of 5A. If you have a 35W HID system you are running in the neighborhood of 3A. If you run 55W HIDs, you are going to be using about the same amperage as a 55W OEM. The efficiency comes in when you are able to get more light out of less wattage. If someone is putting out a 55W bulb that is 9A, it's not 55W. 9A may be the in rush current.

All in all with a Halogen and Incandescent, you are still running across a filament which will be higher resistance til the filament heats which is pretty instanteously, but you still have a path. Where as the HID system requires an electrical arc, which is know as a fault in a lot of applications. This requires high voltage and current which can serious stress a battery and decrease it's life.

Electrical systems don't need minutes or hours to fuck something up. A few cycles can seriously fuck the world of an electrical system tigger. A cycle is 1/60 seconds. Basically you have a major lack of understanding in this topic and it's best to just take your chances that you aren't overstressing your battery with no delay than argue you aren't. Some batteries can take it if they are designed to handle a lot more starting current, Harleys usually have better batteries for this reason because it takes a lot more to start them. Not a lot of sportbikes are made stock with a decent battery to handle over the stock starting amps without shortening the life of the battery.

[marko138]

Originally Posted by Trip

If you install a non OEM bulb that uses a substantial amount of amperage on start up, than you should put in a switch or timer delay. This is one of the reason why dirt bikes and dual sport bikes have these switches installed on their extra lights.

55W bulbs don't pull 9A or they aren't 55W. If it is labeled a 55W, it's going to be close to the standard I = V/R ohm's law. So it's probably going to be in the neighborhood of 5A. If you have a 35W HID system you are running in the neighborhood of 3A. If you run 55W HIDs, you are going to be using about the same amperage as a 55W OEM. The efficiency comes in when you are able to get more light out of less wattage. If someone is putting out a 55W bulb that is 9A, it's not 55W. 9A may be the in rush current.

All in all with a Halogen and Incandescent, you are still running across a filament which will be higher resistance til the filament heats which is pretty instanteously, but you still have a path. Where as the HID system requires an electrical arc, which is know as a fault in a lot of applications. This requires high voltage and current which can serious stress a battery and decrease it's life.

Electrical systems don't need minutes or hours to fuck something up. A few cycles can seriously fuck the world of an electrical system tigger. A cycle is 1/60 seconds. Basically you have a major lack of understanding in this topic and it's best to just take your chances that you aren't overstressing your battery with no delay than argue you aren't. Some batteries can take it if they are designed to handle a lot more starting current, Harleys usually have better batteries for this reason because it takes a lot more to start them. Not a lot of sportbikes are made stock with a decent battery to handle over the stock starting amps without shortening the life of the battery.

Don't you realize Tigger knows more than you so called electrical engineers?

[Amber Lamps]

Originally Posted by marko138

Don't you realize Tigger knows more than you so called electrical engineers?

Come on, you know that I'm just fucking with Trip! IO don't care if people delay their headlights or not... Shit in a way, if he is right, then we should all delay the headlights until the bike is started period although considering that the stator's out put and the fact that it costs more than a battery, maybe putting the HID warmup cycle on the battery is a better option....


In all seriousness, he got his HIDs and had a bad experience, I got mine and had a good experience. What's the real difference? From a technical aspect I'm sure that Trip is right but like Racer said, who knows exactly how long this will extend the battery's life? How do we know that this isn't just a Honda problem? Anyway, I've gotten away with it this long, so I'm not changing mine. Hey Racer, I don't feel like it, call DDM and ask them what they think. They probably sell a delay....

[Trip]

Originally Posted by TIGGER

Come on, you know that I'm just fucking with Trip! IO don't care if people delay their headlights or not... Shit in a way, if he is right, then we should all delay the headlights until the bike is started period although considering that the stator's out put and the fact that it costs more than a battery, maybe putting the HID warmup cycle on the battery is a better option....


In all seriousness, he got his HIDs and had a bad experience, I got mine and had a good experience. What's the real difference? From a technical aspect I'm sure that Trip is right but like Racer said, who knows exactly how long this will extend the battery's life? How do we know that this isn't just a Honda problem? Anyway, I've gotten away with it this long, so I'm not changing mine. Hey Racer, I don't feel like it, call DDM and ask them what they think. They probably sell a delay....

You know most sportbikes use the same batteries from Yuasa right? You're argument about gilles is now completely gone to shit and yet you consider arguing about another topic which you have a complete lack of knowledge. Basically if you want to be like tigger and spend a fortunate on shit and not worry about the cost vs quality. Than do what you want. If you plan on keeping your bike more than a year, it would be beneficial to you to protect your battery and bulb.